One huge misconception about men’s figure skating is that the presence of out queer men in the sport means the sport isn’t homophobic. Quite the contrary – the competitors, the commentators, the officials, and the fans of the sport are often quite blatantly homophobic, as well as blatantly transphobic and misogynistic. Three-time US Champion and world bronze medalist Johnny Weir has frequently been the target of this homophobia, transphobia, and gender scrutiny, perhaps most memorably when two French-Canadian radio hosts called for him to take a gender test because his gender presentation blows their narrow, hateful minds.
Sadly, it’s not just commentators who are this ignorant and awful. One of Weir’s competitors, 2010 Olympic gold medalist Evan Lysacek, just jumped on the “gender test” bandwagon. A fan asked him on Twitter:
The question itself was offensive enough, but Lysacek didn’t have to reply. He did, however, and this was his reply:
Uh, the verdict is never out on anyone’s gender. One’s gender identity is what they say it is, period, full stop, end of story. Any argument to the contrary is pure bigoted bullshit. Weir has vocally and repeatedly identified himself as male. That Lysacek would publicly mock and question Weir’s gender identity is disgusting and unforgivable. And it’s not coincidental that this is about Weir, who receives a disturbing amount of scrutiny and gender-policing because he does not conform to “approved” heteronormatively masculine standards and because he is queer. This comment is a hurtful not just to Weir, but to every fan of his who is a member of the LBGTQI community or an ally. Hell, this comment is hurtful to everyone.
Let’s be clear – this wasn’t a mistake, a misstep, or a slip of the tongue. Lysacek went through his @replies on Twitter, deliberately selected this question, and then replied to it on his public Twitter, where it remained for close to 12 hours, despite the numerous fans tweeting him to tell him how offensive and horrible it was for him to say something like that. Here is a screencap that demonstrates that his reply remained on his Twitter while he continued to tweet about other subjects:
You can see the tweet in question, plus numerous other tweets. You can see that it is from his verified account. (You can also see that I had no idea how to screencap on my computer, which is slightly embarrassing.) There is no question that this tweet was legitimately from Lysacek.
If Lysacek had simply apologized, people might have been willing to forgive him. Instead, he tried to deflect the attention from himself in the most cynical, absurd way. He started to call attention a fake Evan Lysacek Twitter (the username of that fake Twitter was evanIysacek with a capital “I” instead of an “l,” which look identical on Twitter) and claimed he would never say any of the things on that fake Twitter.
Lysacek’s rep, Yuki Saegusa (@YukiSNYC on Twitter), retweeted the first message. EDITED TO ADD that Saegusa has now deleted her Tweet. It’s capped in someone’s Google reader here:
It’s seems like Lysacek and his PR team are trying to imply that it was actually the fake Evan Lyacek Twitter that said the “verdict was still out” on Weir’s gender ID. At the very least, it appears that Lysacek and Saegusa are trying to get the word out that there is a fake Evan Lysacek Twitter so the issue becomes more confusing and people question whether or not Lysacek even said such a thing. Instead of just owning up to Lysacek’s transphobic, homophobic remark and apologizing, Lysacek and his PR team are trying to obfuscate, or at the very least ignore, the issue. This kind of PR move is disingenuous and ridiculous.
Not only that, but this PR move was a giant failure for several reasons. First, while Lysacek was complaining about someone Tweeting horrible things from a fake Evan Lysacek Twitter, he had yet to remove his offensive Tweet about Weir from his Twitter. See these screencaps:
This screencap highlights that the Tweet in question actually came from Evan’s official and real Twitter – you see that the Twitter in question is EvanLysacek with a capital L. There is also my cap again:
EDITED TO ADD that someone was kind enough to mark up my cap so the proof that it’s Lysacek’s official Twitter is more clear:
Again, this demonstrates that the Tweet about Weir did actually come from Lysacek’s real, verified account, not a fake one. Shortly after this cap was taken, Lysacek deleted the Tweet about Weir. However, if Lysacek wanted this pathetic PR ploy to work, he probably should have deleted the offensive Tweet BEFORE he started claiming it was a fake Twitter who was saying such offensive things.
EDITED TO ADD that there are more screencaps and proof. Here is another screencap of Evan’s Twitter, taken by someone else at a slightly later time than I capped mine:
And here is a cap of a Google Reader page that also shows that Lysacek’s offical account made the Tweet about Weir’s gender ID:
Second, though there was a fake Evan Lysacek Twitter with that username, which has since been renamed to @notevanidiots, the fake Twitter never said anything about Weir’s gender. In fact, whoever runs the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter has been repeatedly distancing themselves from Lysacek’s hurtful comment, at one point Tweeting:
I am extremely disappointed in my actual person. No one should ever make a comment like that. I, fake Evan, promise to be better than that.
Damn. I like fake Evan Lysacek better than the real one.
To recap, Lysacek made an offensive, bigoted comment that mocked and questioned Weir’s gender ID. He left it up for hours and hours, while Tweeting about other things like who he was going to eat with. Instead of apologizing, he tried to deflect blame to a fake Twitter, then deleted the Tweet and now seems to be pretending it never happened. Everyone who watched this go down in real time knows that it happened and has screencaps to prove it, and if Lysacek continues to deflect blame or tries to pretend he was hacked, it will demonstrate that not only is he a bigot, but he also must think that his fans are total idiots who don’t know how Twitter works.
EDITED TO ADD that Evan has, in fact, started claiming he was hacked. He has deleted a number of his Tweets, including ones that had nothing to do with this entire controversy, and Saegusa deleted her Tweet about the fake Evan Lysacek account. If you’ve been following this, you will probably find it quite hard to believe that he was hacked. I think the screencaps speak for themselves. Here’s Lysacek crying hack:
EDITED TO ADD Lysacek has now deleted every Tweet of his since April that is not a retweet. I’m not sure if he’s gearing up to claim that everything he has tweeted since April was actually the work of a hacker or what.
EDITED AGAIN TO ADD that @fsonline on Twitter is reporting that Twitter “verified” that Evan was hacked, but there is absolutely no evidence indicating that this is true. Moreover, Evan has still not denounced any of the things his supposed “hacker” said, made any kind of statement, or attempted to explain this mess at all. If anyone has any official confirmation from Twitter that he was hacked, feel free to post it, but I haven’t found any yet.
ONE LAST EDIT It’s been brought to my attention that there is some suspicious stuff happening on Lysacek’s official Facebook page. For example, when he Tweeted about the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter and tried to shift the blame for his Tweet about Weir, a similar message was also posted to his Facebook page. This is my screencap of it:
You can see that the comment about the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter remains on his Facebook page, more than 24 hours after Lysacek deleted the Tweets from his verified, official Twitter account that shifted blame onto the fake account and started saying he was hacked. You can also see that Lysacek’s Facebook account has been updated to say that his Twitter was hacked.
Lysacek’s insistence that he was hacked makes no sense in light of this information. If the offensive Tweet about Weir and the Tweets about the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter were truly the work of someone who hacked Lysacek’s Twitter, then the same information about the fake Twitter account never would have been posted on Lysacek’s official Facebook page. The information that was supposedly disseminated onto Lysacek’s official Twitter feed by a hacker was also disseminated onto Lysacek’s Facebook and HAS NOT BEEN REMOVED, even though Lysacek’s PR team has updated his Facebook to say his Twitter was hacked. The only possible explanation is that Lysacek and his PR people made both the Tweets about the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter and the Facebook update about the fake Evan Lysacek Twitter. This makes their claim that Lysacek’s Twitter was hacked and that a hacker was Tweeting about Weir and fake accounts even more ridiculous and unbelievable.
THE EDITS KEEP COMING Lysacek has just “apologized.” Caps here:
Nothing in this apology acknowledges that Lysacek himself was the one that made the comment – in fact, the vague “Am taking measures to make sure this never happens again” seems to suggest that rather than taking responsibility for what he said, he’s trying to deflect the blame onto a hack AGAIN. Not to mention that if he couldn’t “apologize enough,” he probably would have started doing so right away, instead of trying to blame a fake Twitter and then calling hack.
There has still yet to be any independent verification or confirmation from Twitter that Lysacek was hacked. But instead of owning up to his commen, he continues to try to weasel out of responsibility, even while nominally apologizing for it. I see their PR strategy still relies on assuming Lysacek’s fans do not know how the Internet works.
This kind of behavior is unacceptable from anyone, but for a public figure to do it in a public forum is especially awful. It breaks my heart to think about the young queer, genderqueer, gender variant, transgender, and questioning figure skaters and fans of figure skating who had to see Lysacek mock someone’s gender ID and know that this how an Olympic gold medalist of their sport behaves.
As a figure skating fan, I’m disturbed and horrified that the current men’s Olympic gold medalist and ambassador of the sport is such an unapologetic bigot. I’m also disturbed and horrified that unless people start talking about this, telling their friends, and contacting his sponsors, Lysacek will most likely escape from this unscathed. The best thing to do is to refuse to be silent or forget about this – blog about it, link your friends to it, link it to other blogs, and contact his sponsors and let them know that they’re supporting a transphobe and a homophobe and you’re not okay with it. You can contact his sponsors here:
AT&T
http://fanzone.att.net/feedback
Coca-Cola
https://secure.thecoca-colacompany.com/ssldocs/mail/eQuery_other.shtml
The Coca-Cola Company
P.O. Box 1734
Atlanta, GA 30301, USA
1.800.GET COKE (800.438.2653)
Flexjet
erin.portman@teamone-usa.com (Media Inquiries)
os@flexjet.com (Customer Inquiries)
TotalGym
http://www.totalgymdirect.com/contactus.php
1-800-501-4621
To reach Evan or his agent directly and let them know what you think about this, you have a variety of options:
@EvanLysacek – Evan’s Twitter
@YukiSNYC – His agent Yuki Saegusa’s Twitter
Saegusa can also be contacted here:
Yuki Saegusa
IMG
767 Fifth Avenue
45th Floor
New York, NY 10153
Phone: 212.774.4413
Email: yuki.saegusa@imgworld.com
Notes: These screencaps have been culled from a variety of sources in different timezones. None of them have had the information, the timestamps, or the words changed. The full-desktop screencap is from my computer, which is on CST. If I used one of your screencaps and you would like credit for it, just comment and let me know. If you know of more companies that sponsor or support Lysacek and have contact info for them, let me know and I’ll edit that info into the post.
I will be deleting any comment that implies that Weir somehow deserves this kind of gender-policing. No one deserves this kind of gender-policing, regardless of who they are or what your feelings on them are.
The original version of this post was focused on the homophobia of Lysacek’s comment and marginalized the transphobia that his insulting remark was dependent on. I sincerely apologize for marginalizing the transphobic nature of his comment and I have edited the post to reflect that. There is more discussion of this in the comments, if you’re interested. I welcome discussion of this and any suggestions for additional edits to my post.
However, this blog is intended primarily to create a timeline of events and to provide screencaps.
gender test THIS 
He’s deleting the comments about the “fake” accounts, too now. What a classy guy.
As a transman, thank you for calling him out on this. I’d been a fan, but his spineless way of dealing with this is making me rethink that. I can handle someone making a stupid remark, as long as they own up to it and apologise.
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Evan just made a comment that he was “obviously hacked” lol
I almost feel sorry for the guy because he’s SO PWNED at this point
So let’s see… First it was posers, who were never posing. But when it was pointed out that it came from his verified account (and ONLY then), he was “clearly” hacked.
In twitter terms: #LysacekIsALiar
Love this! I hope this will be updated with the latest developments.
So sad that he’s going with the hacked angle now because no one believed the ‘fake account’ had did it. He’s just digging himself further into a hole.
Thank you for this. I’m a huge Johnny Weir fan, but I’m not thanking you on his behalf. This is not the first criticism Johnny’s received because of his gender expression and it’s not likely to be the last. In his own words, “I’ve heard worse things about me in bathrooms and whatnot.” It’s the kids I feel for in all this. Young male and female skaters idolize both Johnny and Evan. They shouldn’t be pulled into this. And Johnny is emerging as a role model for kids who don’t fit into the standard heteronormative categories. Evan’s tweet is a slap in the face to each of these kids and their parents. I expected more from my Olympic Champion.
Can he actually be this stupid?
I’m confused….
Evan Lysacek, you just lost a fan. I know that you and Johnny’s whole frenemies thing gets a bit overheated at times but that was a cruel and insensitive tweet question to reply to. From all the tweets you receive from fans to answer, you choose that one, knowing all the controversy from the Olympics on something very similar?
For someone who is being touted and wants to be seen as a role model, you are doing a poor job. Man up and clarify, not what your people say but what you feel on this, and why you answered the question and in that manner, but from here on out, I am no longer a fan of yours, I respected your art and was starting to like you as a person from Dancing With the Stars but with that comment, you lost it.
Absolutely unbelievable. And yes, Evan will come out of it unscathed and if someone should ever ask him about it in interviews, he will stick to the hacked account/fake identity thing.
Did anyone cap his DM fails too? I know what they said, did not cap them. This is what he said:
“n which has turned into people attacking me about this. The truth is I could not are any less about Johnny weir…Who he is or what he …”
“o eager to attack me for some reason. I am now leaving it up to my people to figure out.”
“waist my time commenting about him or trying to insult anyone. I just don’t have the time or energy. I have tried to comment but I find …”
“I am distrought over this and have no idea what is going on or what to say… I haven’t had a day off in so long and this weekend is m …”
That’s all my friend got.
Yeah, this was capped too: http://de.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=wcdzzn&s=4
This is a really sad chapter…I’m glad that Johnny steered clear of it. I’m not sure what to believe about Evan’s part in this….but this morning as the fracas was breaking, there were two or three twitter accounts supposedly for Evan. Looks like TahitianFantasy sent the message to the fake Evanlysacek….however HE responded (unless there is a hacking issue that I don’t understand) from his own verified account. Does he scan the fake Evan tweets for messages he thinks are meant for himself? Who knows. This serves as a lesson for public figures everywhere using these kinds of social media, to keep the claws retracted on worldwide bulletin boards. Johnny is a beloved skater, Evan should be a respected one—he lost a good deal of that today.
So someone knew to hack his account just as this other person asked him the question. And this someone only replied to that question and then left Evan’s account. sooooo unlikely. And like others said, first it was a fake account, cept that one reply was without a doubt from his verified account. Sad. If only he had just lived up to his mistake in the beginning.
My main problem with this whole thing is I just CANNOT understand how dumb this boy is!!! I mean, although I’m a huge support of the LGBTQ community, I don’t expect everyone to be as open-minded/liberal as me or my friends (more education and progress is needed!!), but I do expect COMMON SENSE, especially from a grown man who has been exposed to the media and knows how it works.
I mean, all public figures gets lots of crap comments and questions (via twitter or otherwise), and the best thing to do is just ignoring them. But for Evan to go through his @replies and chose this particular tweet to respond to, god, I can’t even wrap my head around how dumb this was. Seriously, where’s your head, boy?!?! Even if he doesn’t like JW, keep it to yourself, dumbass!!!
And now to deny he did it instead of apologizing? What a stupid move?!
sigh… I was SUCH a huge fan of his during the Olympics, but now, I just can’t stand him anymore. Because of his bigoted comment, but also because he’s just stupid…
p.s. he also need to get a new management team. i don’t think they have that much common sense either…
@Stephanie @sa21de: I didn’t witness the tweets about him being distraught happen – they were deleted before I heard about them – so I’m hesitant to include anything I didn’t see go down in real time, just in case the legitimacy of anything on this blog gets called into question. However, y’all can post caps and such in the comments and whatever you want!
@Meow: From what I can tell, the person who asked the question actually asked the real Evan Lysacek account – they just didn’t capitalize the “L” in his name. Clicking on the “@evanlysacek” in her question directed to the real Evan Lysacek account.
Meow: No she sent the tweet to him. In the “fake” one the lowercase L is actually a capital I. if you type http://www.twitter.com/evanlysacek it’ll still go to him (yes, I’ve tested this). The URL is not case sensitive, something he’s not counting on people knowing, no doubt.
He really has done himself no favours with this. He should have just apologized but now he has embarrassed himself even more (if that was possible). Saying something stupid is one thing, not owning up to it is another.
Evan is such a sad excuse for a human being. He’s supposed to be our All-American Golden Boy Role Model? Disgusting.
@sa21de ty bb for the caps. He should have just owned up and apologized, it would be blown over by now probably.
@gender test THIS Thanks!
@Stephanie no problem but all credit goes to http://twitter.com/notevanidiots! 🙂 Sorry, should have said that in my earlier post as well.
What a mess. Evan Lysacek is pathetic. I’m guessing his next step will be deleting his account altogether and pretending nothing ever happened. Well, he already does that.
@sa21de Ahahaha the infamous troll Evan ❤
You can hold an olympic medal in your hand, but it’s what’s in your heart that matters.
Evan Lysacek lost this fan.
A wise man (Dale Carnegie) once said “Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, for your character is who you truly are, while your reputation is only what others think of you.” Evan seems to have gotten the message backwards.
The sad thing is, he’s a fan of the Human Rights Campaign on his personal FB (which he claims not to have, but is linked from his sisters’ pages, so is clearly him). He’s not a TOTAL douche, I’m guessing.
He probably posted that, got slammed with the @replies, had an ohshit realisation moment, and instead of handling it like a man, he tried playing it off.
I’m curious to see how this will play out, because I’m SURE twitter can tell if he WAS hacked.
Rs said: “So someone knew to hack his account just as this other person asked him the question. ”
No, the person who asked the question (TahitianFantasy) sent the tweet about five hours before Lysacek replied.
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Absolutely brilliant write-up! I applaud you for your thoroughness in calling Evan out and in providing the proof. I, too, watched this go down in real time, and have screen caps myself and from others that are exactly the same as the ones you have. Thank you so much for pulling the story together here.
OMFG, Evan. How stupid do you think we are? Apparently as stupid as you, I guess. Appalling.
I can’t believe people are falling for the ‘I was hacked’ excuse. The fact that he tweeted details about his own iPhone app after the tweet about Johnny makes it pretty damn obvious that he was in control of his own twitter.
It sickens me that people are defending him over this inexcusable mess.
@sfm Basically. I mean, it’s not impossible that he and hacker were both in control of the account at the same time.
But, if he’d been hacked, then once he deleted the offensive comment from his timeline, realising he didn’t post it himself (assuming the story was true), he wouldn’t have blamed fake accounts, and would’ve claimed to’ve been hacked MUCH sooner.
But of course his “twu fans forever” can’t think logically and realise this.
Thanks so much for this post. No comment like that should ever be let slide, no matter if it’s made by your friend or by a celebrity. The fact that he is such a public figure, with a significant portion of his fanbase who regard him as a role model is, and he made such a transphobic and homophobic comment all the same is sickening. And there is no valid defense that can be made of that tweet. Thank you again for this write up.
I am a Johnny Weir fan, and as such it’s been frustrating to hear fans over the last several months try to claim Johnny has always been mean and nasty to Evan, but Evan has been a perfect angel toward Johnny, except for one time he apologized for. Bunk! I love Johnny, but I would never try to claim he’s never made a mistake while someone else has constantly been mean to him, even though a lot of people HAVE been mean to him. He’s not always perfect, but he’s never mean. This comment was mean. It was NOT a joke, it was NOT funny, and it was NOT AT ALL excusable. Suggesting it was okay, or that people are being overly dramatic about it, or that it’s not a big deal or so on is INEXCUSABLE ON THE PART OF ANYONE! It is in fact hurtful and disgusting for @tahitianfantasy to have asked the question in the first place, and hurtful, disgusting and STUPID
for Lysacek to have replied. To have handled it so badly when he was called on it makes it even worse. First to claim it was from the ‘fake’ EvanIysacek account, and when that didn’t work, to claim he was hacked is pathetic and unbelievable.
It’s hard to even explain how disappointed I am with Evan Lysacek right now. I’m hurt for Johnny Weir, but I’m also immensely proud of him for acting like the classy young man he is and not dignifying this with a reply. I do fear, however, that in the future he will be asked about it… Sigh!
“It’s hard to even explain how disappointed I am with Evan Lysacek right now.”
This pretty much sums up my feelings. I liked him quite a lot, and to have this happen… it’s a tremendous disappointment really.
you think this is weird, ever see the “NegativeApolo” twitter? there’s some REAL strange ass shit goin’ down there.
I’m still having a hard time thinking it was that big of a deal. Not saying it’s right or it’s wrong, just that people are way too hypersensitive and over-reactive these days and need to have a lil bit thicker skin and/or a sense of humor about things. The comment just simply doesn’t read as intentionally hateful towards the LGBT community or even particularly mean-spirited in general to me… I’m sorry, it just doesn’t, and said hypersensitive overreaction aside, I don’t really understand why everyone thinks it’s so horrendously bad. The comment isn’t “gender-policing”, it just looks like a smartass personal swipe at a RIVAL in his sport to my eyes, pure and simple. I get that this is rather sketchy territory, but it’s sports; people talk trash. So unless explicitly proven otherwise, I cannot find a reason to take Lysacek’s comment anymore seriously than that. And well, compared to the hate spewed in the sibling rivalry between my brother and me back in the day, Lysacek’s comment is laughably tame and downright witty.
I realize this comment isn’t likely to go over well here, and may even get deleted, but I’m not trying to defend Lysacek for “gender-policing” (because in my estimation he is not policing or judging anything) or his mind-bogglingly stupid attempt to handle the situation that resulted. Only BP could defend that mess. I’m not trying to be a troll either, and I don’t believe I’m playing devil’s advocate just for the sake of it. All I’m trying to do is look at things logically and give my honest opinion. And my honest opinion is this: People just really badly need to lighten the heck up and not jump to conclusions so damn much. I believe most, if not all of you that I’ve seen so far, are overreacting to a perceived slight that is at worst completely incidental, if even there at all.
If anyone wants to debate this further, by all means, let’s. I did my best to maintain a degree of respectfulness here though, so I will expect the same in return, whatever the forum.
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@lonestarr: Thanks for your civility. 🙂 To be honest, I think the context of this is really important. Johnny Weir’s gender ID has been repeatedly questioned by commentators and radio personalities, and he has suffered an extreme backlash because he’s queer and he presents “queerer” than many people would like him to. He’s been really open about the ways in which this backlash has hurt him in his sport and has hurt his fans and other young men who are not heteronormatively masculine.
It was a HUGE deal when the French-Canadian radio hosts questioned his gender ID – Weir gave a press conference, it blew up sports and queer blogs on the Internet, and it was one of the most reported stories of the Olympics. There is absolutely no way Evan Lysacek was unaware of this. Honestly, if he was, he would have to be the single most oblivious, stupid person alive. There was already a public conversation about how inappropriate and homophobic it is to question the gender of someone. There is a historical context of people questioning and policing the gender of queer people and of people who aren’t stereotypically “feminine” or “masculine,” and using this gender-policing to marginalize and harass them.
It’s not like Evan was just randomly trash-talking a rival off the cuff. He picked out a specific, offensive question that had been Tweeted at him that he had no obligation to answer. Then he answered it in a way that questioned Weir’s gender ID. That’s not “trash-talking.” That’s mocking Weir’s gender ID and making fun of the fact that Weir doesn’t present in the most stereotypical, heteronormative, masculine ways. There is NOTHING WRONG with not being a man, with being genderqueer, with being trans, with being questioning, but Weir has very publicly said he IDs as a man, and for Lysacek to publicly mock that and to invoke the same trope that the French-Canadian radio broadcasters did is inexcusable. There is no other way for Lysacek’s comment to be interpreted – it relies on homophobic and transphobic tropes to make sense as an “insult.” It’s gender-questioning. It’s gender-policing. And it shows he is both bigoted and has extremely poor judgment.
And honestly, I think if he had just (sincerely) apologized and moved on, he wouldn’t be getting nearly as much flak as he is. But instead he deliberately tried to pretend this wasn’t his fault, tried to shift blame onto someone else, and then tried to claim he was hacked, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. And he STILL hasn’t bothered to apologize or even acknowledge what was said on his public Twitter. The fact that he went to such great lengths to try to shift the blame for this indicates that he knows he did something wrong, but instead of owning up and apologizing, he’s acting like a coward.
Queer, trans, genderqueer, gender variant, and questioning people routinely have the harassment and bigotry that is directed at them explained away as “just a joke,” or something they’re taking too seriously or caring about too much or misinterpreting. I respect your right to disagree with the response to this, but I think it’s pretty unfair and ridiculous of you to dismiss the claims of people by saying they’re oversensitive. What you see as trashtalk is actually the kind of statement that has been used to marginalize and hurt members of the LBGTQI in very serious ways, and I wish you would take that into account before you make any more comments that accuse people of being unable to take a joke.
The problem is, lonestarr, that while yes, it probably was meant to be a swipe at Johnny, it will end up affecting people perceived as Johnny is perceived–outside of standard gender norms in western society.
As one of those people (as I indicated in my first post, I am transgender–also gay), I am offended by his comment. gender test THIS’s last paragraph perfectly sums it up:
“Queer, trans, genderqueer, gender variant, and questioning people routinely have the harassment and bigotry that is directed at them explained away as “just a joke,” or something they’re taking too seriously or caring about too much or misinterpreting. I respect your right to disagree with the response to this, but I think it’s pretty unfair and ridiculous of you to dismiss the claims of people by saying they’re oversensitive. What you see as trashtalk is actually the kind of statement that has been used to marginalize and hurt members of the LBGTQI in very serious ways, and I wish you would take that into account before you make any more comments that accuse people of being unable to take a joke.”
It’s pretty simple, lonestarr: Johnny Weir is male. He is a man. No matter how he dresses, no matter how many sequins and sparkles he puts on his costumes, no matter what kind of purse he carries, no matter how much makeup he wears. He’s a man, and he’s come out and said many many many times that he is a man and he’s happy to be one. Saying the “verdict is still out” on whether Johnny is a guy or a girl is policing his gender, because it’s suggesting that a “real” man doesn’t do those things. People used to suggest that women who wore pants or worked outside the home or played sports weren’t “real women” either. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now: what makes someone a man or a woman is how they identify themselves, and Johnny Weir identifies as male and always has.
Nothing about Evan’s comment was acceptable, and it really wasn’t witty, either. There was nothing fresh or original or even particularly smart about it; it was just snide and petty. It’s not trash-talking, either. Leaving aside the fact that they’re not really rivals anymore (because neither of them are going to compete as amateurs again), bashing on Johnny’s gender presentation has nothing to do with either of them as an athlete. If Evan wanted to go after Johnny’s work ethic in his training, or his lack of mental toughness, or his jump technique, or anything relating to Johnny’s skating or abilities as an athlete at all, that would be trash-talking. This is just Evan taking a personal swing at Johnny, and by extension anyone else who doesn’t fit perfectly into Evan’s idea of what the gender roles should be or what a man or woman should look like, because Evan is a petty, close-minded, judgemental person.
I’m sorry LoneStarr, I disagree with you.
Weir has been swiped at for years for various things, and those swipes reached a new low in Vancouver with the two Quebec broadcasters who suggested he needed a gender test to prove he was a man, and that he should be forced to take one. They were ignorant enough to say it on television.
Evan Lysacek KNOWS this, he knows about this incident; therefore when he was asked a question regarding whether Weir was a ‘guy’, meaning a male, as in a man, he should have either ignored it or stated he wouldn’t answer such a question. However he was dumb enough to answer it by suggesting the ‘verdict is still out’. That response to a clear question regarding Weir’s gender is inexcusable, especially for someone who is trying to promote himself as some sort of role model. Lysacek has been able to sweep a few other stupid comments under the rug, but it doesn’t look like he’s going to be able to do that this time. And he shouldn’t be able to. He should have manned up immediately and apologized for saying something so ignorant and stupid. And it WAS ignorant and stupid to answer @tahitianfantasy’s question at all, let alone suggest we didn’t know yet whether Weir was really a ‘guy’ or not.
If Weir had made a comment like this about Evan his fans would be wanting to hang Weir from the nearest high tree branch; therefore their excuses for Evan in this case to me are pathetic and wrong. And frankly, a number of Evan’s fans are appalled as well.
lonestarr, you make a lot of sense. and even I who was very enraged at first, after calming down a bit and looking back a few hours later, agree that it is all a bit stupid/trivial. HOWEVER, and this is a big however, I believe Evan’s response to all of this crap is much more important. I would’ve been able to just forget about it mostly had he apologized or acknowledged what he did. Instead he insulted my intelligence and is misleading his many naive and gullible fans (dear lord..have you seen some of his supporters’ comments?) with how he reacted.
I don’t think the anti-evan mob want him to literally diaf or anything that drastic. but hey, it’s the internet, things are easily shouted here without repercussion and as a public figure I personally think he deserves all of this online backlash if not more, it’s the least he deserves. I think if a sponsor or two dropped him it’d be an even better “slap on the wrist”. evan probably didn’t mean his comment to be an affront to the lgbt community as a whole, but we hold celebs to insanely high standards, especially in terms of what they say in public, and as a society we should strive to move away from any type of mentality where we have people poking fun at others because they don’t fit into gender norms. It is all the more hurtful because besides Evan’s one major gaffe towards Johnny in the past where he insinuated Johnny wasn’t a good enough skater for SOI, Evan was supposed to be the “polite” one. After all of the incessant drama over Johnny and his sexuality in the past year, I’m pretty sure if Evan had a brain he’d realize how loaded his comment would be. I don’t think it’s as harmless as you think.
I don’t excuse his original comment. I think it was his failed attempt at “witty, sarcastic” humour that came out in bad taste towards a fellow competitor and as homophoic/transphobic towards all.
The hacking/unverified junk – also unexcusable (though almost in a hilarious way for those of us who watched it play out in real time).
But does it really need to be made into such a big deal? Evan should definitely apologize (which he hasn’t done yet – awesome job, PR). This mediocre skater will fade into obscurity once he quits competitive skating in a few weeks/months, and all his sponsorship blah/homophobic comments that he spews from his mouth won’t concern many people except his disillusioned fans (and every celeb has those fans – we can’t rid the world of them).
@Ranjana if his comment was an ethnic or racial slur, with everything else being the same, would you still ask “does it really need to be made into such a big deal?” I’m not asking sarcastically.
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@Patrick F.: I understand the point you’re trying to make, and I don’t think this is your intention, but it makes me a little uncomfortable when people try to compare oppressions that way. Unfortunately, there are a whole lot of people who WOULD excuse it if Lysacek had Tweeted a racist slur slur, institutionalized and individual racism is a HUGE problem in the US and I don’t think it’s a productive approach to say that people would care if this was a racist slur. I’m not trying to call you out or attack you, because you’ve added some really helpful things to this conversation. I’m just not a huge fan of that particular comparison.
@Ranjana: There are a couple of reasons that this is a big deal. One, he’s sponsored by companies like Coke and AT&T, he’s the face of their products, and he’s currently the face of men’s figure skating in the world. He’s getting paid to be a representative an ambassador of the sport of figure skating and of different brands, and he’s doing a terrible fucking job of it.
Someone with that kind of responsibility and financial backing should not be tweeting offensive and homophobic things about their competitors. I would hope they wouldn’t be THINKING those offensive things, either, but I can’t stop them from doing that. What I can try to stop them from doing is airing those feelings in a public forum without criticism.
I think this is a great opportunity to have a broader conversation about homophobia in sports, specifically figure skating. Why do people find this kind of comment acceptable? Why do they write it off as “trashtalking” and just something that any competitor would do? Where did Lysacek get the idea that it was okay to say something like this in the first place? These are all productive questions. Saying that we should just let it go and not have a conversation about this is not a productive response.
And even when Lysacek does fade into obscurity, that won’t diminish the effect his hurtful comments might have had on young skaters who are queer, trans, gender queer, gender variant, or questioning – or any young skaters who don’t present in stereotypically “masculine” or “feminine” ways.
@Patrick
I guess I’m eating my words now. I guess put int that light, I would think it a bigger deal, which sheds light on why this is a bigger deal than I originally stated in my post.
I guess what I wanted to convey was that we should push Evan and his agent to apologize, first and foremost. Recognizing that he made a mistake and making amends for it should have been his first course of action. Of course, he is human and is more prone to try and cover up his mistake than admit it. But he does need to apologize. Not to drag Johnny into this, but when the wink got misconstrued on Chelsea Lately (a much smaller deal than this), he apologized. Evan should extend the same courtesy, especially considering the gravity of the situation.
I just don’t think contacting sponsorships or pushing this into a bigger blow-up is necessary. Like I said, I would like to think Evan meant it in a witty way (NOT in a homophobic way), even though it came off as transphobic/homophobic. And we all make slip-ups sometimes. The cover-up was stupid. He should apologize and then we can all move on from this incident and soon enough, when he retires, he will fade into obscurity where his comments won’t render much feedback.
However, if he did indeed intend to come off as he did, that is a whole other story in which I have no interest defending him in anyway.
@gender test THIS – I wasn’t trying to compare the oppressions though I guess I was. But I don’t see one as greater or lesser than the other, and sometimes it helps people understand the seriousness of what was said, which was why I said it. Though that is a fair point, on people excusing other slurs.
@Ranjana – I do think Evan was trying to be witty and failed. I wrote more above. Basically, I think he just said somtheing stupid, then when he got busted, got even stupider. It’s like the kid who, despite being caught with his hand in the cookie jar and crumbs around his mouth, will lie and swear he didn’t do it. And now, he’s backed into a corner that he doesn’t know how to get out of, because if he apologises, he’s admitting to lying, as well. I don’t see an apology forthcoming. I see dead silence from him and his management on the issue. No more blame, but no apologies either.
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Thank you so much for providing a timeline of what happened. I’m a trans man who was just starting to warm up to Evan and when I saw what he had said, it felt like I’d been punched out of nowhere. The fact that he’s trying to hide his bigotry by lying and making himself out to be the victim is deplorable.
However, this has renewed my interest in writing a paper on athletics and gender performance, so at least something useful came out of it (for me, anyways).
Evan should be more mature about these comments he makes. A mature MAN would own up to his mistake and not blame others for his bigotry. The fact that Evan is willing to lie to us and say that he was hacked into and then it was someone else’s twitter page is appauling. Johnny is the one who is the REAL MAN. Read the article on Espn the Magazine that is called JOHNNY WEIR IS A REAL MAN! If he had made the same comment he would have owned up to it and said sorry by now. That is what a mature person would do. Johnny deserves a little bit more respect than that. He has feelings and he is a MAN with feelings which Evan doesn’t have because his heart is black inside. Jealousy, as Johnny’s mom Patti said, is the real problem here and he will never learn how to respect Johnny until he learns not to be jealous of him. This comment was uncalled for and shows us all why we are not his fans. JOHNNY IS OUR MAN IN EVERY WAY!
I really appreciate this write up of what happened. I was afraid I would get a lot of backlash and hate (I started the original ‘evaniysacek’ and moved it to ‘notevanidiots’). I’m very glad to know from various replies, and this as well, that no one believed his horrible attempt at deflecting the blame for even a moment. I know the Twitter I made was outrageous and extremely inappropriate at times, but I continuously said it wasn’t real and it was very obviously (except not in Evan’s terms) fake. I have received nothing but comments thanking me for not caring about the potential shit storm I may have been involved in, and instead standing up and saying something against his ridiculous comments. There comes a point where snark turns into hate and Evan has crossed this line.
Personally, I’ve had people in real life say similar comments to me and I know how hurtful it is. Not necessarily that someone is questioning one’s gender, but that someone would be that ignorant and purposely hurtful. It’s rather disturbing how some people will go so out of their way to insult another human being (who did nothing we can see to instigate it) just to make themselves feel more adequate.
The original comment was disgusting and hateful, but him trying to pull an outrageous excuse out of his ass to somehow “prove” that my parody account was the actual one at fault just makes it sting that much more.
I have never ever made such comments and I hope to god that I never will. I don’t believe there are enough words in my personal vocabulary to express how angry I was over this whole ordeal. NOT because of my potential involvement, but because of his actual actions. I was quite literally shaking from rage.
I have tweeted this from my parody account and will continue to do so as needed. It’s very well informed with an amazing amount of evidence. Thank you. 🙂
(I apologise if any of my wording, spelling, etc is off. I just woke up, English isn’t my native language, I didn’t read it over, blah blah blah. None of you particularly care. At least I own up to the fact that I probably made mistakes, right? Haha.)
@Deborah: While I appreciate that you are upset, I do not think it is remotely acceptable to claim that Lysacek isn’t a real man or to call his masculinity into question. A real man is anyone who IDs as a man – period. Lysacek may have done something extremely offensive and hurtful, but that doesn’t call his gender into question. Don’t respond to Evan’s gender-policing with more gender-policing. I’m going to keep your comment + this reply up so people can see it, but if I see any more comments that engage in the same kind of homophobia and gender-policing Lysacek did, I’m going to delete them.
@Andrew, you handled all of this beautifully and so much better than Evan “I wuz hacked!” Lysacek. Well done for not taking his pathetic attempt of blaming you for his own actions.
I wonder if he will continue to pretend that someone hacked into his account or if he will simply ignore the whole issue from now on. The chances of him actually owning up to what he said, are slim, I guess. If he couldn’t apologize for the original comment, he sure as heck won’t be honest about all the lying that came after he had his oh-shit-realization.
He probably didn’t understand why everyone was angry at him (because of that comment), that’s why those comments about the fake account. Or it really was a tactic (to try to change people’s attention/to try to confuse them, to make them believe that answer came from the fake account…which is even worse, because people who followed the facts knows exactly what he did). Anyway, he understands it’s not working, he writes a lot of crazy-sad comments(accident?/dosen’t know what to do anymore)…then he deletes them too, and finally claims his account was hacked. Seriously?! I’m feeling sad and disappointed.
At the beginning I gave him the benefit of doubt about that stupid answer (maybe he didn’t even understand all the implications about that sentence (and alone considering that tweet!?!)…he’s only bitter and angry at Johnny, which isn’t right but is not as bad as knowingly insulting an entire gruop of people)…I thought he would apologize or he would stop writing for a while…instead all of this. I didn’t think he was capable of this.
Now I’m angry for his behaviour and for how he offended some people and decided to act as if nothing had happened…but I also can’t help feeling sorry for him 😦
(Sorry for eventual mistakes, I’m not English mother tongue)
I’m not even a figure skating fan but this is just wow.
First off I am about dying with the hacked comments as the tweet come from his iPhone and he answered TWO other questions from his iPhone pretty much at the same time. He really needs someone with a brain on his PR staff, that’s for sure.
Someone should screencap Tahitian Fantasy’s twitter page, her reply to Evan’s tweet (at his verified account no less) is still there! I would but I fail at that type of thing…
Thanks for putting all this information together!
It is truly amazing that such a smart person like Evan can be so stupid. Obviously, Evan tries to make himself out to be totally “different” than Johnny. Honey child, you’re not fooling anyone. Evan…. it must be extremely uncomfortable and stuffy in that closet of yours. Team Johnny!
@lonestarr, thank you! You actually voiced my opinion. I also think people are overly dramatic about this whole thing. When I read Evan’s tweet, I thought it was pretty funny and the question of TahitianFantasy didn’t seem to me like something horrible either. Just a joke, no intent to insult anyone behind it. I was very much surprised when I found out what a scandal it had turned into. And mind it, I am a huge fan of Johnny (however, not a FANATIC) and still don’t find anything insulting for Johnny in Evan’s reply. That comment Evan had made back in April about Johnny not deserving to be on SOI was much more insulting in my opinion. The current issue is being ridiculously overemphasized.
@RC: Yeah, see what I said up there about deleting comments that police Evan’s gender? Policing his sexuality and making insinuations about it is the same thing. His sexuality is irrelevant, and your speculation about it is creepy and off-topic. The point is that he made an offensive comment and then tried to cover it up in a bunch of embarrassing ways. Any other comment on this blog that speculates/questions Evan’s sexuality or tries to imply the reason he did this is because of his sexuality is getting deleted. Seriously, y’all.
@newdaydawn: If you saw lonestarr’s comment, I assume you also saw the discussion about why it’s fucked up to tell members of an oppressed group how outraged they’re allowed to be, that they’re overreacting, and that something offensive is just a “joke.” I’m not sure if your reading comprehension is so poor that you did not understand that, or if you were too lazy to read the ensuing conversation, but either way I’d suggest not commenting on the blog at all if all you want to do is tell people they’re not reacting the right way to this. I don’t really care what individual people’s reaction to this was – you don’t have to be offended or angry. That’s totally your right! I do care when you insist that people who were legitimately hurt by this are overreacting or too sensitive. Knock that shit off.
I don’t mean to belittle this incident, as I agree with much of what’s been said here, but I would like to point out one more stupid thing about Mr. Lysacek’s reply to the original question. The expression he was looking for is “the jury is still out.” Not that it was witty anyway, but it’s really not witty when you fuck up the idiom.
What Evan still doesn’t get and never will, is the fact that many many people love and admire Johnny. Johnny has had a massive fan base for years. Evan clearly thought that his comment was witty and that people would tweet enthusiastic replies about this. When he saw that he got himself into trouble, he had his little meltdown/tantrum. And now he’s sitting it out by not acknowledging it anymore. Though I bet that wasn’t his idea, surely someone in his PR team realized it would be better for him to finally stop tweeting.
@newdaydawn, I’ll thank you not to tell me how offended I’m allowed to be.
Well said. It really doesn’t matter about sexual orientation or identification in this matter. This is the stuff that highschool was made of. You are who you are and your gifts and talents are the result of you as a whole person, whether you have a penis or a vagina!
It was tweeted that The Advocate picked this up: http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2010/08/08/Lysacek_Questions_Weirs_Manhood/?utm_term=%40thebestgossip&utm_content=entertainment&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
I thinks it’s clear that Evan has neither the personal responsibility nor the circumspection required to maintain a twitter account, so I hope he, or his management, decides not to continue twittering. I also think it’s clear that Evan had no idea his comment would cause controversy, which is problematic in itself, and has no idea how to get himself out of this mess. He obviously doesn’t see that what he said was wrong, and based on his tweets about this ruining his weekend in the Hamptons, he is more concerned with how this hurts him than how his comment hurts others. If he had admitted his mistake and apologized from the beginning, I think most people would have let this incident slide, but I wouldn’t accept an apology from him now. Anything he says after this will seem calculating and insincere.
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths people will go to to deny that they made a mistake, or that they are bigoted, or that bigotry exists in general. As for the “people talk trash in sports” trope I keep seeing in the comments here: what the hell ever happened to respecting your opponent? When I was in high school track we wished our opponents luck before races, and I didn’t graduate all that long ago (seriously, it’s been a year). ANY nasty comment or joke Evan would make about Johnny would qualify as “you’re a deucebag” in my book.
Thinking on it some more, I have a few issues with this post focusing so much on homophobia. This isn’t about who he has sex with, it’s about his gender performance. Yes, he’s cis, but the fact is that the entire insult hinges on transphobia.
@Alexei: Perhaps it would be most accurate to describe it as a combination of homophobia, transphobia, and misogyny? Lysacek and his PR team have a history of making homophobic remarks about his opponents – for example, one of the agents that works for his PR firm once said that Evan was such a good representative of men’s figure skating because he isn’t gay and no one would ever think he is, with the implication being that because Weir is queer, he isn’t a good representative – so I interpreted it as a continuation of those kinds of homophobic attacks. However, I definitely should have made it more clear within the post that the insult relied on transphobia and was deeply transphobic. Lysacek also has a history of denigrating other male skaters and the sport of skating as “girly,” which I think is both transphobic and misogynistic.
I think it’s important to recognize the structural homophobia within skating and how Lysacek and his PR team have consistently taken advantage of that homophobia to further his career and craft his image in contrast to Weir’s image, especially because I think people who aren’t long-time fans of figure skating assume that the sport isn’t homophobic at all. That being said, I sincerely apologize that my post marginalized the transphobia that was inherent in the insult and put it on the backburner to talk about homophobia instead. And I think that figure skating as a sport has issues with institutionalized transphobia and gender-policing, as well. If it’s okay, in addition to editing the post to reflect this discussion, I’m going to edit the post to link to your specific comment.
(Comment edited to fix tenses and to get rid of an incomplete sentence – agh!)
I noticed someone had sent this blog to Evan’s “friends” (ie Apolo Ohno, Nastia Liukin, Angela Ruggiero etc). What were you hoping to do? Any response from them? I think they’ll rally behind him or if not it’ll be a non-issue.
@gender test THIS – Thank you for taking my comment into consideration. I know that there has been a long, homophobic campaign against Weir, and I do agree that it’s time to start pointing out the homophobia that exists in figure skating. I just think that it would be best to focus on the transphobia of the insult.
As for trans-misogyny…I don’t know. I’ll admit that I’m not the most qualified to speak on this, but I see this more as femmephobia.
And you are more than welcome to link to my comment. Perhaps someone who is more knowledgeable about the nuances of transphobia and trans-misogyny can correct me if I’m wrong.
@Alexei: That’s an interesting point about femmephobia. Thanks for commenting and taking the time to talk to me about this – I appreciate it.
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@Alexei: Ah, I spoke too soon – I can’t actually link to individual comments, or at least I don’t know how to. But thanks again.
Droned;
This article has been sent to a lot of people BY a lot of people. I pointed some fans of Johnny’s who were upset to this article/blog because I feel like a lot of effort was put into making sure everything was correct and I liked the idea he wouldn’t include things he couldn’t personally verify. I also like the fact he makes a point to read his comments and answer them if there is something he can answer and so on. I can’t speak for the article being sent to any of Lysacek’s friends, etc.; however, perhaps if it has been and they’ve bothered to read it (especially if they have also read the comments to see how people are reacting), perhaps these people can make EL understand why so many people have reacted the way they have not only to what he said, but how he handled it after he was ‘caught’.
I do have to say, I don’t especially like the idea of tweeting to Evan’s friends, myself. Pulling them into is not going to help, at all His management, yes. His sponsors, possibly. His friends? No. I’m friends with a celebrity, and if people sent me things like this… well it wouldn’t help their cause any. It would piss my friend off big time, and it would not open a line of communication. I can’t say that’s how it would be with Evan, but I think involving his friends is a mistake.
Sad2Say says:
Actually @tahitianfantasy reply to Lysacek’s reply HAS been screen capped. In fact, I screen capped it myself. What amazes me about her is she either doesn’t care what happened, or at least is too ignorant to realize how ignorant she is/was. She is floating around talking about sunblock and other things either blissfully unaware or blissfully uncaring.
I don’t believe for one second Evan’s Twitter was hacked. Combined with the evidence presented here, am I supposed to believe someone went to the trouble of hacking his account to make one rude and obnoxious comment about Weir, that they wouldn’t wreak any other havoc with his account?? I’ve seen what hackers do on Twitter accounts, and that was so NOT in the style of hacker behavior…it was in the style of a bigot who has the IQ of a door knob.
IF Twitter is verifying he was hacked, then I would bet he or his PR just told Twitter he was, and Twitter accepted it without question since he is Evan Lysacek, an “Olympic Champion”.
All I want to say is I love Johnny. I’m sad that there are people out there can’t just let go and appreciate him for what he is, beautiful.
LOL The way some of you are reacting to this, you’d swear it was the first lil’ scandal to hit the entertainment business. Blogging and screencapping, timelines ‘n sh*t. lol In a few months this will be forgotten, replaced next week by something else. You all are getting all worked up about this, while Evan is making millions, enjoying weekends in the Hamptons, and he and Johnny are rubbing elbows at SoHo House.
Johnny, we love love LOVE you! You better come back next year!
Evan, You were out with friends at the time of that tweet, may have had “a few too many” and tweeted something really stupid. Maybe I feel you should have owned up to it or whatever, but my life is a little too full to hold a grudge. I can let it go. lol
Enjoy your Olympic GOLD Medal! Love u, Evan!!!!
Go outside and live life peeps! Life is too short to spend it online. Come on! lol
David D,
Evan and Johnny are not buddies. They once were fairly close since they are close in age and came up through the junior and then the senior ranks at the same time. Until relatively recently most of their comments about each other were pretty tame; and when JOhnny discussed Evan even if he had something negative to say it was usually coupled with something about how hard working he was or something similar. Evan would dig a little but stop short of a complete insult. Sometimes he was even smart enough to say nothing at all. Part of the ‘change’ in their relationship is due to the lack of USFSA support for WEir while throwing virtually all of it behind Evan, part of it is due to other things.
They were at Soho HOuse at the same time, and there was even a mini-Twitter blow up over that. It was more of the ‘trash talking’ type of thing than anything else, and certainly nothing like this. The only coverage it got was in skating blogs (including my own) and in skating forums. Johnny tweeted hours before going to Soho House he would be there that evening, and Evan showed up the same night. Later JOhnny tweeted Evan had been there and looked ‘dapper’. Evan later tweeted some goofy pic about a friend of his rearranging the furniture at Soho House. The next day he tweeted he wished he was at Soho House because it had been dead the night before. Well, that was the night he and Weir happened to be there at the same time. Naturally a few people tried to make it into an insult and a dig, which it probably was; just as WEir’s ‘dapper’ comment might not have been 100 % sincere.
However, none of that means this is blown up more than it should be. It’s blown up because Evan made a stupid comment and when called on it tried to make it into something else. Blogging and screencapping was the way to go because it’s too easy to delete and claim it never happened. It’s also easy to accuse people of a coverup or whatever, and having evidence just makes it easier to prove it.
Frankly after this whole mess I’m pretty sure my I.Q. is about 100 points higher than Evan and his P.R. rep put together. What the hell were they thinking? SEriously?!
@David D
Its not about the scandal. Its about the fact that Evan Lysacek, whether one likes him or not, is supposed to stand for something good. Right now, all he’s doing is representing bigots and liars. And the reason he can’t understand why his comment and his continued cover-up are wrong is because this sort of bigotry is considered acceptable in his eyes. Its not and he needs to know that its not. Anyone making these sorts of comments needs to know that they are NOT okay and not something to “lol whatever” at.
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AuntinAZ
Very likely Evan’s high-profile friends will give him the benefit of doubt. They’re in the same boat as he is, and as celebrities they know they’re targets of controversy just like he is. They’ll take his word any day over the word of strangers. You can bet they’ll ignore this blog written by an anonymous blogger.
As for Evan’s reps, OTOH, it’s a different story. Since they’re in charge of his public image, any hint of it being tarnished is never a good thing. Right now, his agency will be in a waiting-for-the-storm-to-clear mode and keep him hush-hush. He’ll just talk about his future projects and charity works (if you can buy his sincerity).
Lol at David. Give me a break. I doubt Evan is making millions. Especially with figure skating costs factored in. This is men’s skating not ladies’ skating. Evan is at best a D-list celebrity.
You talk about his success and how while he’s “living the life” we’re all loser drones on the internet freaking out over nothing right? You forget that along with the quirks of being a celebrity, there are consequences such as having everything you say, especially in a public forum, put under a microscope. Excuse you, we all have lives here and can easily live full lives while still checking in and giving Evan his due “F – U” for being a pathetic bigot just as he can come online when he’s not busy “living it up at the hamptons” to weave intricate fables about the so called “hacker”.
If Evan had apologized from the beginning it would’ve blown over by now. Without the elaborate timelines and screencaps 99 percent of people would believe Evan right off the bat and the fact that a celebrity is pathetic enough to weave such a web of lies after posting sth stupid online (the internet NEVER forgets) means he deserves to be held accountable. That someone would go so far to cover up his ass although he’s been caught red handed is HILARIOUS. You also underestimate the power of the internet, “my friend” as this story has already in a few days been picked up by many high profile blogs and even the Huffington post, so far.
I mean seriously think about it, people get hacked all the time. That a celebrity would get hacked is even more likely.
The fact that there is extensive proof of Evan’s lies and hundreds of witnesses on a certain skating community watching this s**** going down before Evan deleted everything, makes a huge difference. If I hadn’t followed this as it was happening from day 1 I would almost automatically give Evan the benefit of the doubt and think everyone else was being obsessive losers, making a mountain out of a molehill.
But the very fact that he can’t come to terms and take responsibility, that he’s lying to his own fans and went back and forth between very different and very lame excuses, and even now is not taking responsibility despite the mountain of evidence against him, shows an extreme lack of disrespect for his fans and for most of the public at large in general. How stupid does he think we are?
At the end of the day his comment was probably meant more as a hurtful jab towards Johnny, not meant to offend the LGBT community. But his douchebaggery comes out in full play even moreso in terms of how he handled the situation. If you think the “silly little internet” has no power you’re kidding yourself.
@Keith Really? Did you really have to come in here with your misogynistic comment?
@gendertestTHIS Below the name of each person in your comments, there’s a timestamp; that timestamp is a link to that specific comment.
Thank you for providing such a comprehensive writeup of this debacle. I’m glad to see Johnny is handling it with grace, and sorry to see that Evan is handling it so poorly above and beyond (below and beneath?) his original ill-conceived attempt at wit.
For all the people suggesting he might actually have been hacked, I’d just like to point out that Twitter hackers almost always do something to benefit themselves. They post links containing viruses so that unsuspecting people will have their computers infected, or links to pornsites that they run, or “text “BLAH BLAH” to #55555″, which charges the credit card connect to the cellphone of whoever falls for it, all of which winds up making the hacker MONEY in the long run.
Hacking into someone’s twitter to post an update on the victim’s vacation, a cruel remark, and then information about the victim’s upcoming iPhone app (which will be $$$$ for Evan)… how would that benefit the hacker in any way? What on earth would be the motivation?
This is like that singer who got drunk, poasted naked pictures of herself, and then claimed she was “hacked” as an excuse. It just doesn’t work that way.
Keith’s comment has been deleted, and so will any other comment that uses gendered language like that.
@Azz: Thanks for the tip! I appreciate it – I’m totally new to WordPress.
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-rowe/what-it-says-about-us-whe_b_671373.html
Sadly, this is the society we live in, where a 17-month old can be beaten to dead for being “too feminine.” So yes, this is indeed a big deal, and someone with 50000+ twitter followers certainly should be more responsible. Thank you for making it more difficult for him to get away with this. Life is difficult enough for people that are perceived to be “different” without a public figure (Olympic gold medalist, USFSA-backed athlete at that) spouting such ignorant and hurtful comment
I find it amusing that the LGBT community is vilifying a homosexual.
Evan B,
1) Being gay doesn’t prevent someone from being transphobic. Being trans* doesn’t even prevent someone from being transphobic.
2) Thanks for implying that we’re a hivemind. There are queer people who don’t see anything wrong with it.
3) Evan’s sexual orientation, be he gay or straight, has nothing to do with this.
Your attempt at being snarky and flippant wasn’t very good.
@Evan B
1. Evan is not openly gay, so you’re making implications about his sexuality, which has been said not to be welcome here.
2. Some of the biggest bigots have been closeted gays (please note I’m NOT saying Evan L is gay, I’m playing off Evan B’s assumption that he is).
I’m not going to say anything about Weir. He’s a good skater. Do I believe that Lysacek’s account was hacked? Yes. It can happen to anyone. Even skating stars. Weir has gotten past it. Why can’t you get past it? I respect both skaters. But I don’t think that ANY skater should get put down or get slammed. It’s not fair and it’s not right. So stop making rude comments about Lysacek and Weir. Weir’s not very nice when it comes to talking about Lysacek. I still don’t believe that Lysacek said that. I truly do believe that it was a hacker. And you know what? I may be wrong. He may have said it. But he still apologized. And Weir got over it. Let it go, people. Let it go.
Nowhere in his apology does Evan say ‘I apologize’ or ‘My apologies’. He is still NOT taking any personal responsibility for anything that has happened. And the chick that asked him the question changed her name on Twitter to @BahamaEscape and for hours was making like she didn’t get what the big deal was, etc. Then she started apologizing individually to people, but frankly she still doesn’t get it. Her only real regret is that everyone saw it. Because she doesn’t care for Johnny she basically sees no problem with talking about him.
Johnny is male. He states he is male, and that is all he has ever claimed to be. He isn’t a masculine guy, but so what? He is still a male.
The reason for men’s and women’s competitions is so that competitors are generally evenly matched. Men would have an advantage over women in sports, generally speaking. There’s more at play than just genitalia and chromosomes.
@Randy What you said is ridiculous and transphobic. If Johnny says he is male, then he is male. He does not require your speculations and he certainly doesn’t need your gender-policing.
He’s a 25-year-old man that has behaved with class and grace except in relation to one individual, his long-time rival Johnny Weir. He makes a mean-spirited comment directed at Weir–no one else–and then panics. He then acknowledges, “The comment was insensitive, hurtful and offensive. Cannot apologize enough…” He’s hurt his reputation and lost fans. Is it really necessary to now try to end the man’s career and livelihood? I think that’s excessive.
I was initially angry at the reaction in the comments. It seemed to be a harmless joke. Evan’s lies about being hacked aside, I thought that, again, the gay community was up in arms over a silly comment. Even as a gay person, I sometimes get annoyed by groups like GLAAD who need to call almost everything homophobic. I’ll use two specific examples in a moment.
However, I realized after re-reading the post, and the comments, there are a large justification in getting angry at Evan over that reply. The swipe at Weir does a couple things, beyond what has been pointed out:
1) It shows HIS fans that jokes towards Johnny Weir’s gender are acceptable, and furthermore and probably more pernicious, funny. This sets an example that “Hey, it’s okay if he’s been attacked before for his flamboyancy, I’ll still make a comment”. Why is this such a big deal? Because fans copy their heroes, no doubt, and if anyone disliked Weir before, this just furthers the animosity many Lysacek fans have toward Weir.
2) Secondly, and far more dangerous, it sets the ball rolling for physical attacks. A quip from the article reads that children will be brought into this, and this is what scares me. This can snowball dangerously into real hate, and if any little boy wants to be a figure skater, all he has to do is look at the vicious attacks Weir has received, and he’ll be scared. Or worse, he’ll be strong and brave, but his friends will kick the crap out of him.
So, we’ve established why this comment CAN be dangerous. And while most of the comments here are justified, I think there’s a few extremes that need to be dealt with. First off, even though hate can snowball from a single joke, I think that Evan wasn’t purposely trying to instigate hate or bloodlust, or anything as bad as that. He doesn’t need to be fined or kicked out of the sport, he needs to be a man, and apologize. He needs to be a human being, and apologize.
But, not apologize for a hurtful transphobic comment. No, apologize for a joke that went too far (and for the lies, of course). He really didn’t mean it, in my opinion. I think he saw something he found funny, and replied. Was it funny? No, of course not. He made an error in judgment. If Johnny Weir were to be asked a question about Evan’s sexuality, and Weird made a rude remark, which he HAS in the past, our reaction wouldn’t be as extreme. Part of the apology needs to include Evan recognizing his status in the community and sport, and recognize what HIS comments alone can do.
Also, many, many people are not educated on the difference between sex and gender. He was not gender-policing, on purpose or by accident. He, along with his co-joker, were interchanging ‘gender’ for ‘sex’. So he was implying that Johnny might be a female by how feminine he is. Is that better? No, so hopefully no one quotes me as saying that the confusion makes everything spot-on. But I don’t think it necessarily makes it worse, either.
Now is the time for two examples which prove that there have been overreactions in the media and general public about comments made by celebrities/personalities. This isn’t to say that we shouldn’t educate or call-out unjustified comments/jokes, like we’ve done with Evan today, but that sometimes it goes too far. My two examples for why I sometimes get angry at watchdog organizations for calling practically everything homophobic are these:
1. Meredith Veira. She had the cast of Hurt Locker on her show, and someone made a comment about the lead male cast member (he might have made it himself) getting along well with the other guys. It was a neutral comment, in the midst of a discussion. Veira’s reply? “Do I need to be worried?”. Okay, so, that CAN be construed as “do I need to be worried that you might be gay and send you to straight camp or you’ll burn in Hell?” (which is how the gay-blogs took it, except for one I read), OR it can be read as a much more light-hearted “Do I need to be worried you’re cheating on me” or a form of that joke. We make jokes like that all the time with friends “oh you’re hanging out with so-and-so, you’re cheating on me, haha” etc. The fact that this was called a homophobic remark and Veira was made to apologize REALLY made me angry.
2. Everyone will remember the second example, when Kelly Ripa had Clay Aiken on her show, her put his hand to her mouth to stop her talking (I might have done the same) and she said “I don’t know where the hand has been”. Rosie O’Donnell, and a few, (but thank God, less) gay blogs called that homophobic. First, Aiken wasn’t even out of the closet yet, so nice job on outing him Rosie. Secondly, how in the Hell is that remotely homophobic? That could have been said to anyone about anything, and Ripa has small children, it was flu season. Whatever the reason, I’m glad Kelly phoned Rosie and gave her a talking to, because that kind of over-reaction is 100% inexcusable.
All in all, though, this was a remarkably well written post. I think trying to paint Evan as a seething homophobe and gay-basher, trans-basher, etc. is a tad too much.
Command Shift 4 = screen cap to file
Control Command Shift 4 = screen cap to the clipboard (for pasting in somewhere else)
(They seem odd keystroke combos, but will become second nature as you use them….)
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I cannot judge who is telling the truth here (and I will stay off that topic); however, I must point out that “One’s gender identity is what they say it is, period, full stop, end of story. ” is simplistic in the context of sports, where it is not gender identity, but physical sex that matters. If a man competes as a woman there are many sports in which he will have an unfair advantage over the “physical women”; the same is conceivable for the reverse case in some sports. Further, the way I read the screenshots, the physical sex is probably what was referred to.
(As an aside, your sentence is an excellent example of why “they” should not be used as a generic singular—what the sentence actually says is the opposite of what you, in all likelihood, intended.)
@michaelerikson Do you honestly think, that if Johnny was not physically male, nothing would’ve been said by now? He’s shared locker rooms with HOW many male skaters?
No, the question was his gender. Evan knows full well what sex Johnny is. If his sex had ever been seriously questioned, aside from the asshat commentators, it would’ve been dealt with LONG before now.
Let me rephrase–the question may have been gender or sex–the answer was gender.
@Patrick
There is too little context for me to say anything certain, but I note that:
1. There is considerable bashing of some young, male artists (most notably Justin Bieber) for being girls, even when no-one is seriously considering the possibility that they are girls.
2. The lockerroom need not be conclusive proof, considering the situation around Caster Semenya, the speculations about Irina and Tamara Press, or the interesting case of Stella Walsh
1. Which is probably what happened here, no? (And for the record annoys the fuck out of me)
2. I believe I said: “If his sex had ever been seriously questioned, aside from the asshat commentators, it would’ve been dealt with LONG before now.” To wit, skating officials would have required a test to verify his sex. As has been done with Caster Semenya. And Stella Walsh was intersexed. If Johnny was, it almost certainly would’ve come up before now.
Bottom line, let skating officials worry about his sex. Let HIM worry about his gender.
Rather let HIM worry about his sex, and skating officials if it ever becomes a concern. Which it would have before now.
We really need edit buttons here -_-
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No worries: I have made sufficiently many mis-formulations myself over the years.
Concerning 1: My point was rather that these cases are not gender related, but are a means of poking fun at or ridiculing people in an unrelated manner. I would agree that this is likely something that should not be done (for being mean, immature, whatnot), but the main point is that the actual motivations come from a different area and are not (necessarily) signs of e.g. gender-intolerance. Try looking in into e.g. http://roflrazzi.com/ and see how Keanu Reeves is being “mobbed” for his lack of expression, and a hundred other celebrities for a hundred other reasons.
Concerning 2. Even if the officials do not have any concerns, others (possibly out of ignorance) may still have. A better example might be Kratochvilova or Mutola who were seen as men by the odd critic, but who (to my knowledge) were never subject to official suspicions. (For some reason, the 800m has a history of containing “mannish” women.)
Note: I have no knowledge whether 2. in combination with ignorance is a valid excuse for the above people—here I speak of a more general case.
The point is, Michael, it’s not for us to gender police. And it’s not for Evan to. If a skater is concerned about his sex they can lodge a complaint. Johnny’s gender is what he says it is.
For your first point, I read roflrazzi every day. I see the Keanu posts, and the Bieber posts. Whatever the reason behind them Evan, at least, is aware of the rude comments from the commentators at the Olympics regarding Johnny’s gender, which makes answering the tweet in especially poor taste.
Now, I’m one of the few that has accepted his apology (my blog entry on the controversy aftermath is linked as my website), but I’m still not going to excuse his comment, or any subsequent gender/sex debate. It is up to Johnny to say what it is, and if anyone IN the skating world has concerns, they can, as I’ve said, lodge a complaint. WE do not need to discuss his sex or gender.
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Someone else said it but it hits the nail on the head:
Evan is not homophobic or transphobic. He’s Johnny-phobic!
It’s true guys. Evan is a nice fellow, liberal-minded, loves lighting candles, and hangs out at fashion shows with Richie Rich. With so many real bigots in the world, don’t waste your energy crucifying this guy.
You and I have very different definitions of what constitutes a “nice” guy, Nelly. Lysacek made a flippant, obnoxious, and hateful comment which he knew was spiteful and hurtful. It was particularly obnoxious and hateful because he knows what the Canadian commentators said about Johnny during the 2010s. It was a low thing to do, to say the least.
Aside from the fact his mindset leaves much to be desired, there is another issue which I feel is just as noteworthy:
Lysacek chose to compete in the Vancouver Games, he chose to represent the USA. He knew if he won the expectations would be even higher that he not conduct himself in a manner which is “common”, that there are serious responsibilities as an Olympic Champion, as a representative of a country, which consist of more than polishing a gold medal and smiling for the camera. He is supposedly not only one of the best this country has to offer (and the world, according to the judges), he IS the best at this moment in time, but he has behaved deplorably. He couldn’t have acted any less like an Olympic Champion, and he’s an embarrassment because of it.
His crude comment can’t be simplified as him merely having some issue with Johnny…as if his words don’t reflect negatively on the LGBT community, and this country.
As far as “liberal-minded”, I wonder if you are joking. He is, after all, the “man” who has been pushing for Men’s Skating to be “more masculine”. You say he is liberal-minded, but his actions/words make it clear he feels threatened by sequins, and those who don’t conform to his personal standards of what it is to not only look like a man, but act like one. If he was secure about his own masculinity and value as a human being, if he was a truly nice guy and had any real clue what it is to be a man, he wouldn’t spend his time making moronic and intentionally malicious “jokes” which question someone’s gender, and he wouldn’t give a rip how many sequins and “arm flourishes” someone has in their programs.
I’ve never liked Evan’s skating, but I respected his dedication to the sport, and I had no problems with him as a person. Things have changed radically in the last week, though, and I now have less use for him than I do his skating. I had questioned whether or not he was a bigot because he has expressed his opinion that FS needs to be more “manly”, but now I know he is.
Johnny Weir is a man. Lysacek is an insecure, bigoted, and destructive child, and what he now represents has nothing to do with the spirit of being an Olympic Champion, but everything to do with what is wrong with some of the attitudes in Men’s FS and in America.
Lysacek supports should be happy, though, because it definitely looks like he won’t be forced to explain himself since what he did hasn’t even been mentioned by any of the biggest news networks (other than a few online sources: a headline and link at Huffington Post, an article at The Advocate, and some blogs/sites). Sad and infuriating, but no surprise.
Yeah, right…tell us another one, Evan says:
I have to agree with you. I’m not interested in destroying Evan Lysacek’s life, but I can’t excuse his comment. And though this whole thing was a storm of controversary in some places for several days, very few media outlets picked up much about it. I think that’s at least partly due to the fact there’s a lot going on out there and let’s face it, EL isn’t Brett Farve or A-Rod for drawing in media attention. It makes it easier for him to sweep it under the rug though, and it’s sad. It helps to allow the phobia in the sport to continue when it should help it to be dealt with head on.
What’s most frustrating to me is the number of EL’s fans who are still buying either the ‘Someone else wrote it’, or ‘I was hacked’ defense. Some of them are even finding ways to blame Weir, at least a few going as far as to suggest Weir hacked Lysacek. WTF? Others think because Weir has made comments to Lysacek in the past it’s somehow okay; forgetting of course about any comments EL has made re Weir. And the chick who asked the question in the first place is under the impression because she doesn’t like Weir it’s somehow okay. And she has no clue of the difference between gay, gender, sex, trans, and so on.
Thankfully though they are not all like that, some of Lysacek’s fans were very disappointed in him, and in fact, some of Weir’s fans, myself included, felt that he should have not only been more personal with his apology (‘I apologize…, ‘My apologies…’) would have been nice, but that he should also have apologized to his own fans.
I came across a blog quite by mistake last night saying what a ‘Christ-like move’ it was for Evan to apologize. I was like what? Then I realized she didn’t even know about Twittergate. She thought he was apologizing all these weeks later for his rude comments re Weir not being ‘good enough’ for Stars On Ice. Sigh…
Stop being hypocrites. Its okay for Johnny to make comments about Evan being gay (remember the wink from that tv show) but if Evan did it you have a problem?
You are hypocrites. ANYONE whining is in fact a hypocrite.
No I don’t think ANYONE (as in everyone) “whining” is a hypocrite, because you don’t know who of us disagreed with Johnny’s winks and comments as well (as I did, for example).
One does not excuse the other. Nor does it permit it. No matter what Johnny has said or done, there was no reason for this comment.
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Wow. Lysacek just lost all my respect.
@TahitianFantasy, who later changed her name to @BahamaEscape is now @MidnightInFiji (A Springfield). Whatever!
http://tweeter.faxo.com/Best_Forum_Message_Board_or_Blog/2010/08
Hey, you’re in the running for ‘Best Forum, Message Board, or Blog’. People have to vote though, and you can vote once every twenty minutes. You don’t have to be a Twitter member either, you can still vote. Just vote, twenty minutes later refresh the page and vote again!
And she is now
@MidnightInFiji
Tabitha Starfire | Southern Paradise
Hmm. Now someone said, he is “sportsman of the year”.http://www.fannation.com/si_blogs/for_the_record/posts/135161-whos-your-sportsman-of-the-year
BUT THE INTERNET NEVER FORGETS. THE INTERNET NEVER FORGETS.
Well he did handle the questioning of his Gold Medal and so on in a good way at the time, you can’t really argue with that. It’s just that, to me, to be considered a candidate for ‘Sportsman of the Year’ you should behave like one. No one is perfect, but some of his faux pas since Vancouver show he isn’t necessarily the best choice for this award. That’s about as polite as I can be about it! Character counts, IMO.
Frenchie is a stalker.
While I know enough about ‘Frenchie’ to be able to say plenty about her online behavior which certainly can often be not exactly ‘nice’ (especially when she goes into attack mode), what has her being a ‘stalker’ or anything else got to do with this blog or it’s subject matter? And what kind of name is ******?
Sports, gender, questions and hate: From Caster Semenya to Lana Lawless, athletics figures out the future (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/commentary/news/story?id=5879536)
This is a well-written article that discusses gender issues in sports, and tactfully includes Johnny Weir along with others.
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